How Not to Make Me Ex-Gay
Jason Kuznicki on Jul 20th 2005
Several times a year I receive a letter a lot like the following, which is a composite of several that I’ve gotten.
Dear Jason,
I recently found your website, http://www.positiveliberty.com. You seem to be a very good writer as well as very intelligent. I was therefore surprised to read your essay on homosexuality.
I am writing to let you know that you are making a terrible mistake. You may think that being gay is who you actually are, but it’s not. Homosexuality is only something that you choose to do–and you can choose to stop it if you want. A person like you, with all of your talents and abilities, should not waste his life on a destructive, unfulfilling lifestyle.
[Jason and Scott at the Painted Desert National Monument, Arizona, 1999.]Fortunately, I can help you. I managed to escape being a homosexual, and now you can too.
I know what you’ve been through: the one-night stands, the insincere, unfaithful partners, the men you don’t really like but sleep with anyway, and all that desperate searching for your next sexual fix. You’ve got to end it, for your own good and for the good of those around you.
You need to realize that the men you are having sex with don’t really love you. In fact, they hate you. They only use you for their lustful purposes, not for any higher form of love.
Unlike homosexuals, heterosexuals sacrifice themselves and their personal desires for the sake of their partners. They commit to each other and care for each other even when times are difficult. Being “gay” is only about sex, and that’s no way to have a life. Real love is nurturing and fulfilling. It’s something that two men just can’t have for each other. You might tell yourself you have a real love, but real love is heterosexual according to God’s plan.
You are more than just sex, Jason, and I know that you are smart enough to realize this. Deep inside, you know that it’s true. One day you will look back at the homosexual time in your life and be ashamed of it. Have you ever considered what you will do when you get older, and when you aren’t sexually attractive anymore?
Now, you might get angry with me–no, you probably will get angry with me. But this is not hate mail. I am here to tell you the truth, and in your desperate state, the truth is going to hurt a little. You are living irresponsibly, and someone needs to make this clear to you.
And if you do find yourself getting angry, consider this: The real reason for your anger is that you are only mad at yourself for having made a lot of unfortunate decisions. Try to understand that I love you. I love you much more than the men with whom you only have lustful relations. They don’t care about you at all–but I do. And if you only let me, I can help you to leave a very sad and confused time in your life.
Sincerely,
[Often the writers of these letters don't even bother leaving their real names.]
Note: Minor edit to clarify the origin of the text, July 22.
Filed in The Belfry, The Boudoir
Hi
I’m visiting courtesy of “Daddy, Papa and Me”. I was horrified to read how a complete stranger could make such sweeping generalisations about your life, your feelings and your relationship. And I think your pictorial response was very eloquent.
By the way - lovely garden! :o)
Rhea
You responded much much more clearly than I could have. Belated congrats from a stranger on your wedding. :)
Brilliant response. A picture is worth a thousand words. Your peace and confidence shine through.
The ex-gay movement has always been founded upon sweeping generalizations and inaccurate psychology, and this gentleman’s letter only proves it. You response is much more even-tempered than anything I would’ve come up with. Kudos to you.
[...] For my new readers, two of my favorite posts are How Not to Make Me Ex-Gay and Hayek’s Challenge: A Review by a Historian and a Fan of Economics. Light and heavy, respectively. [...]
Beautiful! I got here from Peterson’s blog. So glad I did. I fear that the problem is that the people who are writing these letters, these “happy” ex-gays, only ever got to know their homosexual lust, and they were shamed so much (by both external and internalized messages), that they never had a chance to experience homosexual love. Sadly, they think that’s all there is. I’m so glad you know better.
Your pictures are beautiful, and made me cry :-) You guys obviously have a wonderful relationship, and your happiness in each other is a beacon for what true love (gay, straight or bi) is about. I’m so glad you respond to such idiocy with beauty and love.
Lordy, some people is just so thick. One day, we’ll have a perfect world, where no one hates, no one hurts, and no one judges. Until then, congratulations to you and Scott, have an excellent life together, and good luck with the beautiful garden.
heterosexuals sacrifice themselves and their personal desires for the sake of their partners.
As a heterosexual female, can I debate that with the author? (Well, OK, often as not the *female* will sacrifice herself and her personal desires, but not so rare the other way around. When the man *does* make sacrifices, he is generally with a woman who won’t.
That whole nurturing thing? It’s pretty rare, really, homosexual *or* heterosexual.
What a wonderful “reply” to such mail!! And your wedding picture is gorgeous. You both look so handsome, and so happy.
::Applause::
What an excellent response. I have nothing substantive to add that hasn’t already been said, so I’ll just echo everyone else’s sentiments and say ‘bravo.’
Obviously, your letter writer has no clue. Your response is beautiful. Thank you!
The best damn response to the “ex-gay” “movement” EVAR.
[note use of ironic quotes in title.]
I really can’t add anything to this patient-yet-powerful rebuttal that hasn’t already been said. (Thanks Quev for the link.)
How Not to Make Me Ex-Gay
…
Very lovely. Thank you for sharing this.
Beautiful response. My partner died last year after eighteen years of being together. It was a wonderful relationship. ……..and none of the godzombies had a clue.
The thing that always confounds me about Jason is that he is more “Christian” than the Christians.
I wish the new cooperative blogging effort well. I’m not leaving comments at very many blogs these days, but I still try to read now and then.
I don’t have a lot to add either - but I just have to say, reading the compiled letter amidst the photos was striking.
Blessings to your union, Jason and Scott, from a man who’s been blessed to have a 20 year faithful relationship with another man.
I hope many people see your site and rejoice with you!
The person who wrote that letter to you was clearly speaking to themselves and their own experience. How shameful of them to think they know anything about you. Wonderful post.
Nice response. Were I in your shoes, I don’t think I could do the same.
I came here via One Good Thing, and I have to say, that was the perfectly lovely response to such a misguided person. It’s so sad how Christianity, which is so often touted as being all about the neighbor-loving, is really quite intolerant. Not being Christian myself and thus not having read enough of the Bible to know definitively, I would *like* to believe that Christianity (and all other religions, too) really *is (are)* all about tolerance and love and all that fuzzy stuff, but that people just misinterpret the hell out of it. Too bad all that “If you are gay or are not Christian or you do x, y, or z, you are going to hell” stuff from the Bible makes me believe otherwise.
Anyway, love you two in Ljubljana (GORGEOUS CITY, NO??), love your cat, and love your wedding pic. Best wishes for years of joy and happiness to come for you and Scott.
It’s interesting what’s woven on the web. I came to this story via Hugo Schwyzer’s page (a progressive Christian) from Kendall Harmon’s blog (a conservative Anglican, which is also my ideology).
I am an Evangelical Christian, once a Baptist minister before turning Anglican, and also an ex-gay. While this will likely feed the wrath of many conservative Christians I know, I want to apologize to Jason for comments like this. They ARE arrogant and presumptuous.
I don’t know you guys (though I feel a little more informed from the photos). I would not presume to say that you don’t understand sacrifice or that gay men only think about sex. While people who say such things may pride themselves on, well, not being Fred Phelps, they still don’t get it.
I would only ask that people not make the reverse generalizations and presumptions about conservative Christians, ex-gays, or any other group (or non-group). Contrary to what I have been told repeatedly, I am not full of self-loathing, in denial, or totally miserable. I know what I believe (in this case that same-gender sex is not God’s best for anyone) and I know the changes that have happened in my life. At the same time, my (many) gay friends know my love for them. I pray that for them, my straight friends, and for you, I may be a conduit of God’s love and peace.
Frank
Man, friend, child of God, and (rather low on the list) ex-gay
“I know what you’ve been through: the one-night stands, the insincere, unfaithful partners, the men you don’t really like but sleep with anyway, and all that desperate searching for your next sexual fix.”
I’m going through an identity crisis–apparently during my twenties, I was a gay man!
Because clearly, right? this behavior is WRONG WRONG WRONG and is CAUSED BY BEING GAY and WOULD NEVER HAPPEN IF I WAS STRAIGHT, right?
Congratulations to you and Scott! As to Mr. Ex-Gay… (1) how much would you bet me that he’s bi and doesn’t realize it because he’s been taught that such a thing can’t exist? (2) I’ll bet he doesn’t get many dates, because he’s creepy as hell! If I met someone like that, I’d still be running.
Jason, this is, without a doubt, one of the best posts I have ever read and looked at (because it is the pictures that truly make the post). I can understand why this is one of your favorites. — Dave
Fantastic post! Though I’m professionally wary of generalizing from anecdotal evidence, there’s nothing to refute an attempt to apply a generalization than well-presented anecdotal evidence….
I’m here via daddy, papa and me. What a wonderful lowkey but powerful rebuttal. Dang, I always wanted to be a gay man, and now I just know I’d have 6 yrs of coupledom photos if I was, instead of being a woman. Y’all get all the best guys! :D Congrats on the relationship those photos testify to, and on your wedding. ps loved tallgirl’s comment! I wonder if there is an ex-straight movement for those unsatisfied by barhopping and cheap straight sex?
Gays 1, Ex-Gays 0
The juxtaposition of an ex-gay’s letter and scenes from a gay couple’s life make Positive Liberty an instant addition to my blogroll. Welcome, y’all!
…
Excellent rebuttal
This is probably the best rebuttal I’ve seen directed to the so-called “ex-gay movement.”
I got a little weepy, too, there at the end. Your garden and your kisses look great. Thank you for sharing this.
I love you guys!
I wish you all the best. I hate generalizations about heteros as if just being straight alone is enough of a character reference.
And being gay is a bad character reference alone.
All the ex gay movement has proven is that repression is possible.
But hell, just because it was before doesn’t mean it was or has been a healthy thing to be repressed.
Rise brothers….
As Victor Hugo once said, “There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come.”
That gay people should marry and take care of and cleave to one another is more blessed than any of us should judge otherwise.
Rise….
It’s time.
Jason and Scott, wonderful post and I really enjoyed your pictures, I can tell that you are a very happy couple and love each other unconditionally. I too have that in my life, a man I’ve shared my life with for 13 years and this fall, we will be married. This was a great response to the ex-gay letter you got and I congratulate you for it. The ex-gay movement makes me angry and sad at the same time. Angry because people like us have been brainwashed into believing that they are sick and unworthy human beings the way they were born, by people who have only one agenda: that is to make life as miserable as possible for gay people. Sad, because I see so many good people falling for the lies and narrow thinking of the christian right. One can be a christian and maintain their gay identity. To Frank and others, I will not judge you but, I encourage you to accept yourself for who you are and stop letting others run your life. Being gay is about so much more than sex, it is about life, love and happiness and their is nothing wrong with that. Nobody can take this away from us unless we allow it. I will never accept their judgements that being gay is a flippant choice or only sexual behaviour because it is not, this is a complete lie. Ex-gays are free to believe what they want, but don’t assume that they speak for all gays because they most certainly don’t. I really wish I could reach out to ex-gays and help them realize their authentic self and not the person that others judge them or want them to be because they will never live up to those unrealistic expectations of themselves. I am not swayed by evangelical christian judgement of my being, it is a false and pretentious way of looking at life in my view. Thanks for your great work guys, just my 3 cents worth. Tim W.
Great pix! I’m jealous of your travels. Killer garden, too. I’m afraid I am an “abandonment gardener”: I plant ‘em, I water ‘em regular for a week or two, then they’re on their own. And do you know what happens when I do try to keep a pot on the porch going? This!
The old saying goes, “There’s nothing worse than a reformed (fill in the blank).” I truly feel sorry for those who have been brainwashed or browbeaten into abandoning the sexuality their brain was wired for. (Excuse the dangling preposition.) And alas, they feel they must preach to justify it. Somebody’s therapist is gonna make a bundle, whether it’s theirs or their spouse’s or offsprings’.
This is the only post that has ever brought any tears to my eyes, and they were tears of joy. Truly beautiful. Pictures speak more than a thousand words.
I laughed in delight while I read this. You two are a cute couple, and I wish you the best in your marraige. Found this from http://www.exgaywatch.com. Also, upon reading your essay… I wish that had been online when I was coming out.
Simply Put
One of the best responses to the Ex-Gay movement I’ve ever read….
I love what you created out of that creepy letter. My first time to your wonderful website. I’ll be back!
So being gay is all about sex, then.
I appreciate it when sex addicts show their colors so plainly. It’s a shame that they can’t see the difference between their own addiction (risky anonymous sexual behavior) and being gay. Your response is one of the best I’ve seen so far.
[...] UPDATE: Jason wins. [...]
AWWW…sniff,sniff!!
Came from Wayne Besen’s site and wanted to extended support and congratulations too!!
Ironic that it’s hetero males that are causing most of the problems from war to rape! But have a thought to throw out- on one hand nothing is done to hetero males that deny women their rights or curtail their own sexuality(ie. no consequences for fathering unwanted kids,etc.),but society is preoccupied with two people loving each other!
FONDLY in PRIDE,
x0×0x
Great response to sad people who have just gone from one form of sexual confusion to another. When will all these sad people realize love is about what’s inside, not what’s outside? Even my Mother told me over 25 years ago ‘Real love is a rare and wonderful thing. Don’t waste it if you find it.’
congratulations, I only hope one day that I manage to find a love as precious as the one which you two share.
The pictures of your life together are lovely and a good example to a lot of gays. I’m going to keep a hold of the webpage and look at it from time to time when I’m not having a good day to make me feel better and lift my spirits.
cheers
Lawrence
So brilliant! Thank you for that!
I especially enjoyed the mahjong photo. LOL! Seriously, it made me as happy as if I were being tickled.
“Our wedding, July, 2003″
Congratulations & good luck. If anyone has anything else to say to you about that, well, it’s clear you’ve already figured out that their opinion doesn’t matter much. Very classy response.
This was great… and whats even better is I can point to about ten other couples in my circle of friends who could give the same response. Thank you for sharing this!
With all the undesirable, destructive and hateful things that reside in this world it always amazes me how some people can criticize love just because of its wrapper. Fools, it’s still candy. But these people I worry for most because they are the ones eating liver wrapped in the recycled candy wrappers leftover from those who have taken the delicious truths for themselves and are savoring it. These painful skeptics snatch up the discarded outer coverings of truth and understanding and fill them with bitterness, jealousy and other unhealthy ingredients like misunderstanding and guilt then pawn it off on themselves and others as something substantial - they’ll never fool me into believing it could be half as sweet as what I’m sucking on. They may call it love because they are using Love’s wrapper but Love Conosieurs know the difference between a pill and Jolly Rancher - a grenade and a Gumball - a nuclear bomb and a Werthers. The later leaves a much better taste in your mouth….I worry for people who can’t understand that, at least.
Your entry depicts how I idealise my future, and I cannot begin to describe how emotionally uplifting your photos are from my perspective. (You look very dashing in your tuxedos.) I think we are all agreement that the mission of the ex gay movement was still born. I nonetheless submit, albeit with a great deal of chagrin that though the ex-gay author’s views on the lives of gay men may be a sweeping generalisation it remains nonetheless a generalisation. My point is this: any affection rooted in physical attraction, as opposed to Platonic love, necessarily and logically contains a measure of selfishness, notwithstanding that sex is shared. However, the awful truth is because the expression of homosexuality was repressed, demonised and criminalised throughout so much of recent history it could not flourish except as an underground movement, by definition unlawful - and thereafter severely frowned upon. Through its legal and physical menace and affirmative actions society has thus inhibited homosexual relationships from developing as selfless, long term unions and homosexuality could only express itself in its crudest most selfish form. Unfortunately we are still struggling to emerge from this period of darkness and whereas ignorance and legal, cultural and parental obstacles persist I am ashamed to say I must concur with a fundamental point that your persona of the ex-gay says: gay men only have lustful relations. By no means all gay men: Scott and yourself are inspirational beacons. You been together for 20 years, which means you must have lived through disagreements, differences, multifarious obstacles that I cannot begin to imagine, but which hopefully await me. Nevertheless, my personal experience mirrors the statistics - gay men are more promiscuous than straight men. So while, as I have stressed attitudes must change among the conservatives, both those who take a fundamental stance and wish to sanction the expression of homosexuality and the moderates who wish to make us invisible - keep our private lives private - we must take positive action to ensure our positive liberties and earn the respect we deserve. We cannot win simply by changing the law or taking part in pride marches once annually, we must follow your example, Jason and Scott. We must form couples, visit national parks and monuments together, celebrate anniversaries and hold hands in the street! Only then can we really be proud of ourselves.
Your entry depicts how I idealise my future, and I cannot begin to describe how emotionally uplifting your photos are from my perspective. (You look very dashing in your tuxedos.) I think we are all agreement that the mission of the ex gay movement was still born. I nonetheless submit, albeit with a great deal of chagrin that though the ex-gay author’s views on the lives of gay men may be a sweeping generalisation it remains nonetheless a generalisation. My point is this: any affection rooted in physical attraction, as opposed to Platonic love, necessarily and logically contains a measure of selfishness, notwithstanding that sex is shared. However, the awful truth is because the expression of homosexuality was repressed, demonised and criminalised throughout so much of recent history it could not flourish except as an underground movement, by definition unlawful - and thereafter severely frowned upon. Through its legal and physical menace and affirmative actions society has thus inhibited homosexual relationships from developing as selfless, long term unions and homosexuality could only express itself in its crudest most selfish form. Unfortunately we are still struggling to emerge from this period of darkness and whereas ignorance and legal, cultural and parental obstacles persist I am ashamed to say I must concur with a fundamental point that your persona of the ex-gay says: gay men only have lustful relations. By no means all gay men: Scott and yourself are inspirational beacons. You’ve been together for a long long time, which means you must have lived through disagreements, differences, multifarious obstacles that I cannot begin to imagine, but which hopefully await me. Nevertheless, my personal experience mirrors the statistics - gay men are more promiscuous than straight men. So while, as I have stressed attitudes must change among the conservatives, both those who take a fundamental stance and wish to sanction the expression of homosexuality and the moderates who wish to make us invisible - keep our private lives private - we must take positive action to ensure our positive liberties and earn the respect we deserve. We cannot win simply by changing the law or taking part in pride marches once annually, we must follow your example, Jason and Scott. We must form couples, visit national parks and monuments together, celebrate anniversaries and hold hands in the street! Only then can we really be proud of ourselves.
Your entry depicts how I idealise my future, and I cannot begin to describe how emotionally uplifting your photos are from my perspective. (You look very dashing in your tuxedos.) I think we are all agreement that the mission of the ex gay movement was still born. I nonetheless submit, albeit with a great deal of chagrin that though the ex-gay author’s views on the lives of gay men may be a sweeping generalisation it remains nonetheless a generalisation. My point is this: any affection rooted in physical attraction, as opposed to Platonic love, necessarily and logically contains a measure of selfishness, notwithstanding that sex is shared. However, the awful truth is because the expression of homosexuality was repressed, demonised and criminalised throughout so much of recent history it could not flourish except as an underground movement, by definition unlawful - and thereafter severely frowned upon. Through its legal and physical menace and affirmative actions society has thus inhibited homosexual relationships from developing as selfless, long term unions and homosexuality could only express itself in its crudest most selfish form. Unfortunately we are still struggling to emerge from this period of darkness and whereas ignorance and legal, cultural and parental obstacles persist I am ashamed to say I must concur with a fundamental point that your persona of the ex-gay says: gay men only have lustful relations. By no means all gay men: Scott and yourself are inspirational beacons. You’ve been together for a long long time, which means you must have lived through disagreements, differences, multifarious obstacles that I cannot begin to imagine, but which hopefully await me. Nevertheless, my personal experience mirrors the statistics - gay men are more promiscuous than straight men. So while, as I have stressed attitudes must change among the conservatives, both those who take a fundamental stance and wish to sanction the expression of homosexuality and the moderates who wish to make us invisible - keep our private lives private - we must take positive action to ensure our positive liberties and earn the respect we deserve. We cannot win simply by changing the law or taking part in pride marches once annually, we must follow your example, Jason and Scott. We must form couples, visit national parks and monuments together, celebrate anniversaries and hold hands in the street! Only then can we really be proud of ourselves.
Thanks for a brilliant post! I have been married to my dear husband for almost six years and this is just the beginning of our relationship. Even though we have been totaly exclusive and faithfull to each outher I almost every day get comments of me and hubby beeing promiscuous, hateful, lonely and going straight to hell for beeing in our loving and commited relationship. I am so thankful for my life, our children and all what God has given to me!
*laughs*
Oh, that letter is _priceless_!
As I’ve always claimed, the “gay gene” not only endows the bearer with endless witty comebacks, but also a flair for classy timing (not to mention superior color sense). You two look lovely in those tuxes!
Great “a picture is worth a thousand words” response to the composite letter!
My uncle, who was with his partner for nearly fifty years until they were parted by death, would have loved it if they could have been married. He was a fashion designer and made my mother’s wedding dress, which was unique, simple, elegant, and beautiful. I sometimes wonder what kind of wedding suits he would have designed from himself and his beloved.
That last paragraph was interesting. It almost reads like the letter-writer is coming on to you. I wonder, for how many self-loathing closet case letter-writers might that be a sub-text?
Best wishes!
All I can say is *WOW* I am so in awe of your honesty, bravery, and insight. Your essay is an eloquent story of a truly amazing journey to self acceptance. I not only applaud you but give you a standing ovation. And I’m not even gay. I am just a person who has deeply felt every experience you described. I am not gay but I have struggled with the same feelings in my journey to becoming and accepting who I am. It’s amazing – pain is universal and it is the ultimate equalizer. It knows no prejudice and unites us. What is rare is your amazing transformation. You are a beautiful person and you must honor and respect all that you are; you’re just as GOD intended you to be. Perfect!
BRAVO!
Ciao,
Katie Galasso
Thanks to http://thatcoloredfellasweblog.bloghorn.com/, which led me to http://arbitrarymarks.blogspot.com/, which led me to your post. I really enjoyed your reading your reply. I am not sure I would have been so creative.
Thanks
TBLJ
Backtracked from TCF, too. Great post, and brilliant at distilling - and refuting - the party line these people are wed to. God forbid they might fall in love. And the pics, well, they = nK words, don’t they?
good for you. find love where ever you can! Don’t let anyone get you down, if you’re gay, that doesn’t make you bad….you know what makes you happy, and that is all that matters in life. What you feel is not respective of what other people think you should feel!
Best wishes!
Kris.
Well done!
I do think that if people know you and they want to comment on how you live your life, and you are cool with them, then that would be alright I suppose. I am not really going to choose a side here, but if this is the way that you feel you should live your life, then you have the freedom to do that, if not, you have the freedom to choose the other way. If people are ex-gay, then they have the freedom to do that as well. I just don’t think that we should be criticizing anyone for the way that they live their life. I don’t want to speak for all christians, but the ones that I know are true to their beliefs and yet don’t judge others. I feel bad that they get such a bad name around certain circles when a vocal minority make it seem like they are all judgmental when I don’t feel they are. Just in the same way that all homosexuals are not chasing after lust. I understand where he is coming from and I honestly don’t think he meant anything by it in the way of hurting anyone. If anything, if I had read it, I would take it as a compliment because of all the times that he said how intellegent I was. But, people need to noy judge others, and if someone wants to change the way they live, they will. If not, people telling them otherwise isn’t going to do the trick.
Great response. I always think it is funny when people act like gays don’t have relationships. My first relationship lasted a year (hey, I was only 19), my second 15 years and I am presently in my third relationship which is going strong at three years. Most of my heterosexual friends do not have this kind of track record. Loved your pictorial response. Very mature. Bravo.
Please come to my house and fix my garden, thanks.
That was so beautiful and eloquent. A picture really does say a thousand words. Belated congratulations on your wedding! You guys make a beautiful couple. (Your garden is lovely as well!) I wish you all the best for the future. =)
Love is love is love, and love is beautiful. I believe that all love is of God and hence He endorses it in all its forms. The man who wrote that letter is clueless and most likely bitter. He is also arrogant- who is he to say what is and isn’t God’s plan? As a Christian, I am appalled at the arrogance and hypocritical actions of my bretheren- they are NOT God, they do NOT know what God likes or dislikes, and for them to judge others is to go against the very teachings they shove down others’ throats. Kudos to you for providing the perfect response to such blatant ignorance.
Well, they do say that the best revenge is living well!
Who the fuck do these religious whack-jobs think they are?
I came here through a link on a friends LJ. I absolutely love your reply to this persons letter. Congratulations on your wedding! It’s hard to find a perfect partner, it truely looks like you have. Best wishes for your life together.
Just another one of the crowd applauding you for your elegant response. I’m a lesbian in a 6.5 year relationship, frankly, we have one of the strongest relationships of anyone we know, gay or straight. It really has nothing to do with sex or sexuality, so much of life is just plain, ordinary luck and hard work.
I find it amazing how many gay people I know who decided to become “ex-straight” due to a string of bad hetero relationships. (rolling eyes) If every straight person who has had bad relationships gave up on the opposite sex then the world would be mostly gay. But it doesn’t work that way, does it?
I’m sorry that the guy had so many bad experiences but it wasn’t the “gay” part, sadly a lot of people go through stages like that, looking for love in all the wrong places, etc. Most of my gay friends are in serious, monogamous marriages, with mortgages, pets, children, etc. Honestly, most of us are pretty boring. If only the gaybashers and the “ex-gays” would open up their eyes and see this. But it doesn’t fit their homophobic agenda, does it?
Best to you and yours,
zoe
You might be amused to know that this page has been cited by
(of all people) the Reverend D. L. Foster, of the ‘ex-gay’ blog
http://psimo.blogspot.com. I posted the URL in a response to one
of his unhinged rants back on July 26th, and this morning he posted
it as something he just ‘ran across’. So, just as evil always contains
within itself the seeds of its own destruction. his efforts to hold
you up to obluquy and derision (for posting a composite letter, apparently)
have resulted in wider exposure of your fine efforts. Heh.
Beautiful post! And you two look great, and so does your garden!
Hi! I haven’t read the responses above so I am not sure if I’m being repetitive… Anyways, this paragraph:
“You need to realize that the men you are having sex with don’t really love you. In fact, they hate you. They only use you for their lustful purposes, not for any higher form of love.”
could have easily been written for a woman (hetero). Don’t you think?
So I am leading a hetero lifestyle and have not found nurturing, fulfilling, “real” love. So what’s wrong?
Wow, the ex-gay guy at http://psimo.blogspot.com is one helluva arrogant jerk! He puts most angry right-wing blogs to shame, makes them seem tame.
Apparently he thinks he’s super-intelligent and superior to others, enjoys insulting other people, but the second someone criticizes him he just deletes anything he doesn’t want to hear/read/think about. What a hack!
It’s unbelievable to me that anyone could criticize that kind of beauty and love. If there was more of that in the world, this would be a happier place, don’t you think? Your response was beautiful.
A Picture’s Worth…
The car I owned when I lived in Columbus, Ohio was liberally (heh) decorated with bumper stickers. I occasionally got some heat from passersby about the “Come the Rapture, Can I Have Your Car?” and “The Religious Right is Neither”…
Super Cute Homos Trump Illogical Fundy Asshat
Kyra, a commenter on Pandagon puts logic to the inanity of fundy ex-gay talk sent in to to the super-cute Positive Liberty, and me likey:I know what you’ve been through: the one-night stands, the insincere, unfaithful partners, the men you
Very sweet.
I am a progressive hetero sex-positive progressive Black man who absolutely despises such bigotry as what that letter represented…but your responses in the form of that photo collage did far more to stick it to those f**ktards than any puny words I could ever say. I find it simply breathtaking that these sexually repressed yet sexually obsessed”ex-gay” closet cases could have the gall to diminish you for living your life with such integrity…then, on the same breath, justify child molestors and rapists on the Church payroll.
May you and your life partner live well and prosper.
And may I have permission to link this page at my own sites??
Thanks, Anthony
Welcome, Pandagonians!
A few quick notes…
1. Anyone who wants to link to this post may do so.
2. I’ve read D. L. Foster’s reply, and I consider his charge of intellectual dishonesty to be entirely baseless. I am not in the practice of disclosing confidential e-mails, but if he asks me politely, I could provide him with excerpts from some of the letters I’ve received. Otherwise, I have nothing to say to him beyond what I’ve already (shown) above.
3. I don’t hate ex-gays. If someone really has changed from gay to straight, then in the end, it doesn’t really affect me at all. They have their lives, I’ve got mine. But I do suspect that mine is happier.
I got to say, you’re a cute couple. You two seem to like parks, so give Yellowstone a try. It looks better now than it has for a quarter century. Best wishes, peace and soul.
Superb effect, juxtaposing the text and the images.
Cheers to you and your real love, not reactionary Christian “love.”
God made you, and innumerable other gays as well, and must be presumed to know more about His purposes than some anonymous weirdo who’s desperate to entice you back into the closet.
Why said weirdo would want to do that is obvious: if you’ll agree to pretend that being gay is just an arbitrary behavior, not part of what you are, then perhaps he isn’t lying to himself when he tells himself he can wish himself straight. You can all hang out together and tell each other that it’s working, that you’re getting better at it, and that it truly is God’s will that you should kill off and falsify such huge chunks of your own souls. While you’re at it, you can convince each other that the Christian-in-name-only bigots really do believe you’re not gay anymore, and that they accept you as equals.
If by “heterosexuals” you assume the letter writer means “people who’ve managed to convince themselves they’re ex-gays,” parts of that letter are heartbreaking. Ex-gays sacrifice themselves and their personal desires for the sake of their heterosexual partners? Right. If their personal desires are still having to be sacrificed, they’re not ex-gays. They can go on all they want about “nurturing and fulfilling” relationships that happen to not be about sex. What they’re saying is that their hearts aren’t in it. And why should they be? The relationship is built on a lie.
As for the contemptible assertion that real love can’t exist between two men, I can only point them in the direction of 2 Samuel, 1:26, where David laments: “I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women.”
They should look at the book more often.
Congratulations! (but not to the letter-writer, who is in need of some kind of help)
My 1930-something Methodist hymnal says in its marriage ritual that the ring is the ‘outward and visible sign of an inward and spritual commitment’. That’s all that’s needed for any marriage.
Hi guys. Just wanted to say I am impressed with your response. It would have been very easy to rant about christians or the far right. You make your point so much more eloquently by whispering.
Just got directed here from http://kfmonkey.blogspot.com/ , and I wanted to add my voice to the chorus of kudos and praise. This is an excellent and elegant rebuttal, and you and Scott are a beautiful couple.
Congrats! On your wedding and your life together live it live it happily.
Well done on your answer back.Beautiful pic’s of your life together. Your garden is beautifu. Toast to your long and healthy loving life together. Now go and have awondeful family . Much Lovepc
Congrats on the wonderful garden! Thanks for sharing all that. =)
Just another queer Christian dropping by to say “Hats off.” I do tire of the overwrought meddling of some of my coreligionists. Your response, with its gentleness and love, was far more Christian than the words — or intentions — of the letter-writers.
And maybe it’s shallow of me, but I’ve never seen an ex-gay as beautiful as the two of you…
Came here via a ridicuous post made by that “ex-gay” tool DL Foster. I took issue with it here: http://redtory.blogspot.com/2005/08/extradordinary-fib.html.
That he missed the obvious point you were making with the juxtaposition of your various snaps (lovely wedding kiss pic, btw — Oh, and I snatched it for the purpose of my little rhetorical exercise… hope you don’t mind) with the silly cant of these repressed fundy wingnuts who seek to “convert” gays and view it as a disease or whatever, shouldn’t be a surprise. This DL character is dumb as a box of rocks and it’s rather sad that he has a ministry and a pulpit from which to propagate his lies and bigoted idiocy.
Anyway, best wishes to you and Scott. Much happiness to you both.
Yikes, what’s up with that justified formatting? Sorry. That wasn’t intentional on my part…
That letter was silly. Your photo response was perfect… telling and beautiful without having to stoop to arguing.
You garden looks beautiful and makes me jealous. You two look happy and great together.
Why is it that people want to try and limit or define love? Shouldn’t they just be happy that people have it?
I think anyone who takes the time to argue the right or wrong of gayness is either ignorant or is jealous of other people who allow themselves to live their lives happily, in the way that makes them happy.
I wish you nothing but more happiness together… and less stupid comments and letters from people like that.
Oh, how beautiful. I absolutely could not read more than half of that insipid letter, but I drank up every frame of your beautiful, strong response. I particularly appreciated the inclusion of the gardening photos. There is no stronger metaphor for love than a garden.
I hope you enjoy your life together for many many years. Cheers!
I’m here from Creek Running North.
What a wonderful post! And I love the garden - clearly you two are as good at nurturing plants as you are at nurturing each other.
Great pictures. Wonderful vision. My own response to “turning someone straight” - aka Exodus……
I call mine INTOUS.
I’m thrilled to have found a new daily read!
What an excellent response to all those meddling fundies who will never understand the joy of being out and proud. The “ex-gay” movement is as ridiculous as it sounds. You are who you are, and don’t ever be ashamed of it. Great photos and best of luck to the both of you!
Wonderful post, Jason, very touching.
I just want to let you know that not all Christians are homophobic…there are many theologically orthodox, yet socially progressive Christians out there, me included. We embrace our gay brothers and sisters, not despite the Gospel, but because of it. So don’t write all Christianity off because of the Christian right.
May you and Scott have a long, happy life together, and God bless.
You have more class in your little finger than a great many people do in their entire bodies. This is utterly fantastic; thank you! (And congratulations on having such a wonderful relationship; pictures ARE worth a thousand words!)
Who Needs Words?
I’m a writer so when I get pissed off, I tend to, you know… write. But there are other ways to argue. Via Creek Running North, a bunch of pictures are worth bunches of thousands of words arguing with homophobic idiots.
Wow. How funny. Your presentation was brilliant and touching. Cheers, and my best to you and yours.
Speaking as a staunch Christian–God is Love. GodisLoveGodisLoveGodisLove. Jesus said the most important commandment was to respect God, and the second was to love each other. Just keep loving one another, and the rest will take care of itself.
I love your response. Pictures really are worth…well, you know.
I do love those pictures - some of the sweetest ones I’ve seen in a long time, and the best possible response to a letter like that.
Congratulations on your marriage.
love
Catherine
hey, i have to say gongrats on getting married, it’s good to see two people happy together regardless of how the extremeist christians view your lifestyle. i myself am christian, and i respect your choice to be happy with your partner. christians often like to single out homosexuals for the simple reason that hatred and fear are so often what drives us to form our opinions. i dont know what im trying to say here, but i want you to know not every christian out there is a bible thumper, and filled with hateful madness. i cant preach to anyone because i have my own faults, so yeah. i hope you guys have many long years together.
god bless.
dylan spaniel
Beautiful! What a wonderful couple you make.
What a beautiful, perfect, loving response to that idiotic and ignorant letter.
Many blessings on the two of you, and may you have a long and happy life together.
If someone asks you to deny or reject your true and honest love, they ask you to deny and reject the Divine One Who gave it to you, and Who is embodied in all love. That, to me, is the worst sin of all.
Pavers on the Road to Hell
Jason Kuznicki posts an absolutely poetic response to an ex-gay looney.
Definately worth a look. Also be sure not to miss the essay mentioned in his post.
…
[...] Unlike homosexuals, heterosexuals sacrifice themselves and their personal desires for the sake of their partners. They commit to each other and care for each other even when times are difficult. Being “gay” is only about sex, and that’s no way to have a life. Real love is nurturing and fulfilling. It’s something that two men just can’t have for each other. You might tell yourself you have a real love, but real love is heterosexual according to God’s plan. [...]
Hello,
I have deliberately put my e mail address there because I am a 20 year old gay guy who has read through this site and disagrees with the discrimination that has occurred through this guys time.. Even when you get these up right wing christians go on about god wanting homosexuality to be wrong… What makes us Gay is the same essance as what makes a straight man straight.. Did you ask for the Hetroseuxal??? No… Did we ask for this lifestyle??? A lifestyle to love the same sex??? No.. If god cannot accept me when i die because I am and have lived a life what I was destined to be then he is a very very cruel essance.. God is not a person not a thing.. He is an essance.. A beleif and until proof that god hates gays is shown then I shall continue to live my life.. I have a website online where i wrote all my terms with coming to my sexuality and how in 10 years I tried to die via suicide more times than i care to count.. Because i didnt die i learnt that god wants me to be truthful to myself.. He wants me to love myself as one should be loved..
Imagen a world where your told that being hetrosexual is wrong.. Imagen a world where your life is lived in fear?? What will people say if i tell them im gay??? Well my attitude is.. Dont love or like me for who I am… Then your not worth the pot i pissed in.. This world is not about hetrosexuality or homosexuality.. It is about coming together as a race.. To live in a peaceful society that we shall never get… In society we should learn to be kind to one another and stop being so stuck up… If someone is gay and comes out that they are gay.. Dont discirminate them for who they are… Coming out as gay is like telling your father that you are a dad at the age of 12.. Yes thats right.. It scares you.. I know when i told my mother that I was gay.. She was fine and said.. Son you are what you are and for that I love you 100% as i did before.. I wanted children before i realised i was gay and i still do. I intend to have them via surrogance and know alot of people with gay dads or sons… They love the thought of a gay father and never got abuse in school.. The thing is today society in the united kingdom give gay men and lesbians a right.. A present a past and a future.. Discrimination is ending in the united Kingdom.. As jesus once said to a prosititue.. I dont like what you are… But i still love you.. You are one of gods children.. Many people in society need to learn that the site editor and his partner are happy.. In a zoo in germany i think it was… They had gay penguins… To see the article look it up..
Before i end this.. I would like to leave a message to all those who havent yet accepted it inside.. Dont turn a blind eye.. It is a heart breaking story to see the pain some people feel about coming out the closet for who they are… Offer a hand a shoulder and a help if required… Because someone comes out as gay doesnt make them any different to how they were one week prior to that…
God doesnt hate gay men… He hates the homophobic people regardless of the bible.. We are all gods children… To proove what god hates go to http://www.google.co.uk Type in Two gay iranian boys Hung… Do some reasearch and look at how the islamic faith treat us… No religion accepts this but they seem to find it acceptable… I know in my soul the people hanging allah as already condemned to hell for their crimes as allah wont accept it…
May god have love on all those requesting it regardless of their status that god gave them
Mystrow xx
This is a message to jason…
You do what your heart feels right to do.. Dont let no one upset or push you or any of us aside… We are all still men and all have feelings a heart and a passion to live in a society of co operation.. Your site is fantastic your pictures show happyness and what we all want and if people cannot accept them.. They are not worth anything..
You are you nothing more nothing less.. We are made the way we ment to be…
Whats the difference between a gay man and a hetrosexual without any children??? - Nothing
Jason - Great post!
At first, I just laughed off the whole ex-gay movement and their supposed converts’ newfound heterosexuality. But, after reading about poor 16 year-old Zach’s experiences with Love In Action’s bootcamp earlier this summer, I began to worry about the potential emotional damage being inflicted on young people.
Your poignant response in photos says more to these young people than all of the shrill arguments between the two sides of the controversy.
Jason - a friend of a friend pointed me to your website, and I want to say how refreshing it is to hear such an intelligent, balanced response. I know people who would have written that letter with the best of intentions, and your response, pointed and deliberate though it was, was respectful and measured. As you know, and can see from some of the similarly heartfelt but vitriolic responses, there is often little of that in any debate or discussion of homosexuality. Bravo, bravo, bravo.
Thank you for sharing this. In your place, I would have found it hard not to just respond vitriolically, but I think the undermining with photos was far more effective.
That’s awesome Jason. I agree with so many here who have already said it….nice touch with the photos…no need for a rebuttal to that kind of a letter!
Eric
Two World Collision
Beatiful. I’ll be adding this to my blogroll posthaste.
Fantastic. This is the kind of response we need to have. I rarely have time to read blogs, but this is one of my favorite entries on any blog, ever.
Justin
GayChristian.Net
This is WONDERFUL!!!! Not the letter, not the fact that you’ve gotten crap like that. (I do, too. Except that I’m bisexual, so that opens up an extra can of worms.) But the pictures…wow. The life and love they depict…wow. The fact that you have shown over a hundred people what same-sex lovin’s all about…WOW!
“Suspicious minds are talking/they try to tear us apart/they don’t believe in this love of mine/they don’t know what love is…I know what love is.”–Tom Jones, “You Can Leave Your Hat On.”
*hugs*
Well done. Your wedding picture said so much I nearly cried. I do wonder if the author of the letter was really jealous and “loved” you more than he wanted to admit.
Have a happy life and don’t look back!
; )
You guys Rock
thanks for the compilation…….nothing new there….just the same old gross generalisation from people who have judged the rest of us by their own behaviours.
keep up the good work.
anthony.
http://www.freedom2b.org
Brilliantly said and a Brilliant comeback to the ex-gay movement! Kudos to you both. I am a gay male in a monogamous relationship of four years and I hope to tie the knot as soon as I get my degree and we both get established further and buy a house with a nice yard. Oh and by the way, late congrats on your wedding and may all the blessings be bestowed upon it. Lovely pictures and a very lovely garden you have grown. I am into gardening and I would love to have the ultimate garden myself and hope to have one soon…any tips?
Jason and Scott - my input is biased as Steve and I have been together for almost 5 years. We have a wonderful committed well rounded relationship. I also know that the Bible is a tool we can use to ‘learn’ or as a tool for ’spiritual violence’. I choose not my homosexuality, which is a gift from God, but to ‘learn’ from God.
Looking at: Ecclesiastes 9:1 we find: [ A Common Destiny for All ] “So I reflected on all this and concluded that the righteous and the wise and what they do are in God’s hands, but no man knows whether love or hate awaits him.” I think that is what many Gay men and woman find today at this juncture. We must take each of these opportunities as they come, to show what GOD meant when we are told “For God so loved the world”, not just for some, not just part but “the world” in which he created us in his likeness. Your picture response is both compelling and imaginative. Thank you for taking the time to share, take a stand and be who GOD made you to be. Cheers; ~dean
Jason,
I like the creative way you responded to “them”, but there is a message also for those of “us” who are able to see it. Your work was a little touch of genius.
As a gay man I necessarily find myself on one side (or the other), but I must confess I don’t like the way it feels. I doubt that it was your intention to create yet another line to divide us.
I don’t know the hearts and minds of the authors whose letters you used to build your composite letter. Almost certainly they see a big horrible “black” line and feel the need to be on one side or the other. We obviously see the line as well. Those on both sides seem to need the validation that winning others to their side of the line brings.
The only way to win? Don’t play the game.
The only weapon the Bible gives us to conquer our enemies … love. We conquer our enemies by making them our friends.
Good luck in life and in your relationship. A good relationship is truly a blessing.
Sincerely,
George
Jason & Scott -
Alvin (my partner of 24 years) and I congratulate you both and appreciate the manner in which you have addressed the situation. You did it with such class and dignity instead of entering into a lose-lose debate, and I greatly admire and appreciate your approach. I feel sadness when people make a judgment call based on fear and ignorance, and I firmly believe that to put a face on the issue can make a difference. Of course, that act requires opening one’s mind to diversity and difference, and that can be a struggle for some. It is truly sad and saddening that the writer believes two men cannot love one another and be committed to each other. I agree wholeheartedly with George (see preceding item) when he wrote “A good relationship is truly a blessing.” and I am convinced a blessing from God. Thank you for sharing of your lives with the rest of us.
Darryl
They say living well is the best revenge and in that spirit, I hope you and your partner live a long and happy life together. Best wishes and good luck to you both!
Dearest Jason and Scott! What a wonderful response you gave as it is an example that mere words would create warfare of argument, but the photos and actions you’ve demonstrated created an argument of loving response. I know the feelings I’ve experienced about trying to cure homosexuality, and for many years failure overcame that cure. I learned my lesson that it cannot be cured and that I could hurt myself more. Fore example I’d always been happy and bouncing around until the days advanced to discouragement and dismay that I wasn’t quite a happy person. The discouragement and dismay made me want to hide or contemplate suicide. It was a spiritual and mental battle that I had to be so humble to let go and turn to the higher power–God.
The loving partner I’ve been living with nearly four years now has shown me not mere physical love, but love deeper than anyone could explain. The spiritual answers could only give me the best guidance and that love is spiritual. Our marriage took place only four months ago, and we got such overwhelming support from our families! Spiritual love truly demonstrates its goodness and attractiveness.
I wish to say “Thank You”. Your photo-response tells it all that I would have loved to do the same as you just did.
Loads of love
Mikki
Jason and Scott, what a wonderful reply in pictures.
Congratulations to you both, belated and from a stranger, may your lives be forever happy.
All the best to you both,
Marian.
Fabulous reponse to someone who is clearly judgemental and unsure of their own identity. Congrats to you both on your wedding. The pics were brill. Wishing you both all the best, now and for the future.
Regards,
Mary
Thanks guys. I’m gay and have always inclined toward the monogamous loving couple thing and it warms my heart to see you together…..as it warms my heart to see any two people who find each other in genuine and deeply affectionate love.
Your response is reminds me of the power of the image of the man standing in front of the tank at Tienamen Square…..the simple beauty of your response is more powerful than the tanks of the Religious Right.
A challenge to someone out there to get this shared with someone like Oprah and have it broadcast to a larger audience. It is very much deserved.
Thank you so much for your reaction. Yours is “wisdom” at its best: to let facts and reality be the answer… And in this case, those pictures were largely enough to make your case, even without words. Wow, such an inspiration for all bloggers!!! God Bless. Lorenzo
Bravo. I have curtsied in your honor. That is a HUGE sacrifice, seeing as how I’m a lesbian and the curtsy does not come naturally. :)
I deeply admire the sharpness of your answer… That’s really great! Millions thanks: it helps me to understand how we can answer to silliness and not be as silly as the one we answer to… all the best for both of you and congratulations for your wedding!
You might want to look at some “homo” statistics that are followed by the website they came from.
78% of homosexuals are affected by STDs. (sss.inoohr.org/homosexualstatustics.htm)
The life expectancy at age 20 for gay and bisexual men is 8-20 years less than for all men.
(www.capitolresource.org/Marriage/gaystats.htm)
Also, homosexuals have a higher rate of suicide — 24 times more apt to commit suicide.(www.capitolresource.org/Marriage/gaystats.htm)
Just some food for thought. I can only hope you will change your lifestyle.
Jose–
Your first website doesn’t exist. I even tried changing “sss” to “www,” and it still didn’t work.
Your second website doesn’t cite its sources, which renders it pretty doubtful. There are a LOT of bogus statistics circulating out there about gay people, in part spread by people who want to “change their lifestyles” — but based on hatred and bigotry, not on love or genuine concern. Google “Paul Cameron” sometime for a summary of a lot of this material.
But, in any event, let me tell you a little more about my lifestyle:
1. I don’t engage in the kind of risky behavior that would give me STDs.
2. I am very, very happy with my life. I would never even think of suicide.
So… While perhaps some gays might get STDs or commit suicide, I’m not one of ‘em. And besides, what’s a better way to stop suicide — convincing someone to be happy, or putting them through ex-gay therapy, which overwhelmingly does not work and will only increase their frustration? What’s a better way to stop STDs — encouraging gay men to form stable partnerships with other gay men, or getting them married to women they can’t fully love, and leaving them to fulfill their sexual desires in secret?
Now, Jose, I am sure that you really ARE concerned for me. But the first step in showing a proper concern is to do a little listening, and to try to determine whether your preconceptions really match the reality that you’re facing. Here, I don’t think that they do.
Mr. Kuznicki, what religion (if any) do you participate in? I’m just wondering. Also, did you have a good family life when you were a child? Reading up on homosexual relationships does not sound like it is beneficial to society — including children upon whom homosexuals prey. Two adults of the same sex were not biologically and psychologically created to be in a marriage relationship. Homosexual relationships are a sick misuse of the word “relationship.” It is like having sexual relations with an animal or plant. It is wrong and biologically confused.
jose –
Let’s suppose that all of the bad things you’ve read about homosexuals were true.
(They aren’t true; most of the items I read at the one working site you mentioned were clearly taken from Paul Cameron, and his research was fraudulent enough to get him disbarred from the APA. But let’s pretend that all these things are for real, just for the sake of argument.)
What would you say if there were perhaps a small number of homosexuals who weren’t interested in molesting children? What if they weren’t into drugs, didn’t have unsafe sex, and hoped to live to a ripe old age, in part by living healthy lives with one committed partner? What would you say if they didn’t want to commit suicide, and if these few carefully avoided reckless behavior of all other kinds?
Would you treat this minority just the same as the others, merely because they happen to both have sex with men? Seems pretty unfair to me.
As to your other questions, I won’t dignify them with a reply. I said all I care to say about such things in the photo essay I gave above, and I stand by them.
Homosexuality is going against the biological use of the human body. We were created to be heterosexual and, regardless of those who actually thing homosexuality is okay and fine, it is wrongfully using humans. What’s the difference between homosexuality and beastiality?
The difference between homosexuality and bestiality is that where an animal can’t feel genuine love or nurture another human being as an equal, a man or a woman can. Because physical love can mean more than just a glandular release for humans, they are called to make the most of it in a way that animals never are.
You may argue that a man can’t love a man as fully as a woman can love a man, but that’s a very different argument from simply saying that male-male love is the moral equivalent to bestiality (or vegetable sex, as you said before). Because of our ability to plan for the future, to provide for one another, and to care for each others’ greater needs, sex with humans takes one a value that it does not have with animals. (Do note that I have never had sex with an animal and that I find the practice personally repulsive, but that I’m trying to frame this discussion in neutral terms to illustrate the difference if I can. I don’t expect you to be brought around to my way of thinking, but I do think it’s best for both of us to state our cases as fairly as possible.)
And reading comments like jose’s, I cannot for the life of me imagine why.
I really understand about it and I feel bit like that inside of me.
I myself am a sixteen year old gay male.
And I would like to tell you, Jason, that you are an incredible person. You’re exactly the kind of person that I look up to, and hope that I can be as level headed and eloquent as you, in response to the prejudice and hatred of people who don’t understand. I applaud your intelligent response, and I hope that one day, the efforts of people like you make a difference in our world.
You and your husband’s wedding photo is absolutely gorgeous - I hope you live a long and happy life together.
And a wonderful garden!
-Lazarus Blackman.
I am a bisexual male.
I have read your essay, and this beautiful photo essay. I know you probably won’t see this comment, but I’d like to say it anyway.
Thank you.
Thank you for being a voice. Thank you for speaking up.
Kudos to you Jason for an intelligent, effective response. As you’ve demonstrated, there’s no need to argue. Clear thinking individuals will understand the meaning behind the photos you presented. The others will continue in their ignorant fear.
Best wishes to you and Scott! By the way, do you play mah jong? It’s a great game ^_^
Beautiful photo essay. The visual rhetoric is more powerful than words could’ve been. Beautiful.
On behalf of what I HOPE are the majority of straight people who think like I do, I’d like to apologize to you for having to put up with things like that.
Things will change with time, but that doesn’t really make it any less frustrating NOW, does it…
Can’t understand why people think being gay is not right. The author of the letter though telling he escaped from that sounds to be gay.
Being recently disappointed by love myself, I’m really glad to see how someone is able to give an irrefutable argument in this discussion: gay love DOES exist. Thank you! I hope I will also be a believer, very soon.
Love from a 23 year old Dutch boy.
How could someone be so closed minded?
being gay is not a CHoice..
It is not something that you just wake up and say ..
“i think i want to be gay”
and hetrosexuals are so much worse..
they may have more .. “happy lives”
but that is cause they are publicized more..
the movie relationships..
we all know some girl that has cheated on her bf.. or been beaten by him..
how often does that happen in a loving homosexual relationship?
nice kiss by the way
lucky man
I realize that this post was ages ago, so you’ll not likely find my humble comment here, but I just wanted to say thank you. The photo montage you did to accompany the piece of utter drivel that you’ve received was incredibly moving.
Wishing you years of happiness together.
i think that God put some love in some people for there own sex brothers. it is naturely present in some boys so they always like other beautiful boys and they a natural attraction for the same sex. so nothing can be done. Other people must consider it positively. nusad.
Hi Guys
we have a lot of work to do dont we. so many preconcieved ideas and misconceptions about who we really are. I spent 22 years living with the belief that I was unacceptable to God and others being gay. I was a well known preacher and leader in the the Assemblies of God and married with kids for 16 years. Eventually i was forced to admit that I was lying to myself that nothing had changed or ever would.
today i love being a gay man….and doing all i can to inform inspire and dispel the myths.
thanks for reminnding us again how out of touch some people are when they see same sex attraction as a sin, a choice or the result of a dysfuntional upbrining.
congratulations on the wedding and may you be like so many out there who have enjoyed a wonderful life with their same sex partner……..over many many years.
love
Anthony Venn-Brown
Author of ‘A Life of Unlearning - Coming Out of the Church, One Man’s Struggle’ Foreword by Hon. Michael Kirby.
Winner of the Sydney Gay & Lesbian Business Association’s ‘Gay Book of the Year’ 2004
Download Chapter 1 ‘The Confession’ FREE on the book page of http://www.anthonyvennbrown.com
O.O dude…. i’m a lesbian teenager, and i’m horrified complete STRANGERS would do this to you. My dad’s like that, he said if i ‘chose to be gay’ then he would disown me… I can’t tell hi mto shove it, cause my mom needs the child support. But now im ranting lols…. but anyways, these idiots that send u this, they are DUMB. honestly…. its not a ‘choice of who you have sex with’ as my dad puts it, but its doing what feels natural, being with that one person you love, regardless of gender….. I’m proud of you and your open homosexuality, and, btw, i love the garden, and the pics of you and your husband
hello my friends call me lady c i am an ex lesbian i was gay from the age of 5
my first girlfriend was in 1st grade i married a woman and was with women only
all my life i am 32 years old now. at the age of 30 i married a man we are happy
i had never been with any man before him . he is my first the sex is not what i am use to seeing i was a stone stud and not a fem. but now i like girly things for me it was a craving that i woke up with i droped this hudge wall i had built from men i was never raped or anything comming up i just loved women and i was very manly but now i am friends with all my ex’s they had to except my change.
my family really loved me my church dident talk about me i had no preasure to changd my lifestyle i was and am still very much loved all of my ex’s were loved
by my family also so there are people that change for whatever reason i am one i dident feel i was going to go to hell and i am very spritual i am a church musician so i can say i went from butch to house wife and now i feel i kind of missed out on my younger girly time by being so boyish. i am learning to wear makeup such as lipstick i now have long hair and i love myself and my girly body
i almost had a sex change thank god i dident i could wright a book cause i lived as a man for 15 years and now i live as ………………me……
god bless you all no matter your plight………..love and peace.
I found this website accidentally through on online search, and I just want to say I think your wedding picture is really beautiful. I’m 17 and gay and I’ve always wanted a wedding, and seeing two men having one… well, it’s really inspiring. Thank you.
I’ve just stumbling across this entry and I realize it’s now old, but clearly still inspiring. When I came out some six years ago (I’m 23) I was taken to a therapist bent on ‘correction’ … I’m now four years into the most amazing relationship. It’s been forever since I stopped to reflect on being gay, let alone get teary eyed over it! Thank you for making me teary eyed, you’ve created an an incredible statement. Congratulations and the happiest wishes to you both.
I found your reponse fantastic, peaceful, intelligent. I enjoyed so much your photos, I hope you live a life of happiness and joy with your partner.
Thank you. Responding to hatred with love, to anger with compassion, does so much more than any other response could.
Congratulations on your marriage of love. My love and I have been together for about three and a half years now, and it still surprises me how many people (even among the “accepting” crowd) are surprised to discover how long we’ve been together. I try not to show my surprise, however, reminding myself that I’m helping to change these people’s beliefs to be even more accepting and understanding that the only thing different about our relationship is that we’re both men.
I’m really sorry but if you actually believe this guy then there is something wrong with you. I’m only seventeen and trust me its not something you just choose to be. Do you think we like being with guys for the kicks of it. Wrong. If your one of those bible freaks that say that god hates gays then your quite mistaken. God doesn’t hate us because if he did then we would never be on this planet. God doesn’t like the fact that we are the way we are but he also doesn’t like people like you who to tend to judge people like you.
Well Interesting. I have to say I completely agree with the person who wrote you that letter. They may not have left their name, but I will. See I have spent the last 15 years of my life having male gay friends. I started off open and objective, and have since competely changed my persepctive, just by watching the actions of theses individuals. EVERYTHING, and I do mean EVERYTHING the orginal author wrote it true. With rare rare exception, have I ever seen a long term happy gay couple. It lasts as long as the sexual interest lasts, but when the men get older, the interest in them wanes and they find themselves alone and totally unloved. After so many years, of watching multiple couples, I do believe hextrosexual couples will sacrifice for each other..and gay men simply do not. It is all about them and their egos. There is no true emotional intimacy…again and again and again, I watch the sad reality.
Then I strongly believe that there is only a small number of true “gay” men. The rest are bisexual..and the gay community is so discrimitory aganist them, that they make them feel like they have to choose. Well they do not. But again, I have several “gay” men friends, who secretly wish they could “go back” after being an a gay relationship over 10 years. But now they feel trapped by their own “coming out”.
If you are so secure in your relationship, you should not attack the guy or gal who wrote the letter. Thank them for their opinion and appericate their concern. But that very fact that you do respond like you did, makes me question your own security. It shows a narrow mindedness, if reversed towards heterosexuals, you would call them homo-phohic. It does not work one way.
Mind you, I truely believe some people are born gay. However,I also KNOW there are those who choose to be gay for emotional or other reasons. Usually pain from a failed relationship of the opposite sex Whether you want to admit that or not, it is the truth. Then look at the homsexual communities fantasies. Story after story of a gay man’s perfect dream, to convert a straight guy. Why? If you can not convert someone?? Another straight male friend of mine is annoyed at them trying with him for years and I am annoyed at the lesbians trying at me for years. I thank them for the complement, but no. And I challenge anyone to really look at the reality and say that none of this it is not true. Rather, the gay community just wants to deny the facts.
As for why do some men turn to a man, frankly after listening for so long, I have come to the conclustion that Women demand certain emotional intimacies. Many men find this uncomfortable for a variety of reasons. It is easier to be with a guy, so they do. They do not have to face the challenge of dealing with themselves. Lord knows I have been around enough of them and watched the pain it causes.
So you can attack the orginal writer all you want, but it will not hide the truth, that some men can and should return to being straight and not everyone is like you.
Debbie –
I did not claim to speak for all homosexuals here, and I am sure that some have had experiences like the ones you describe.
Also, I did not attack anyone. Nor did I even attack anyone’s beliefs. I simply showed pictures of my life, in between a bunch of things that people tell me all the time. I posted this not because I’m angry at the people who say these things, but because I’m puzzled. My experiences just don’t line up with their assertions. And I’m afraid my experiences don’t line up with your claims, either.
It will be ten years this October since I came out. And also this October, Scott and I will celebrate our eighth anniversary as a couple. As I understand it, we will have lasted longer than the average heterosexual marriage by a year. It’s not like I have to prove anything to you — in this life, we are all individuals, and we are all responsible to ourselves and our loved ones alone — but there you have it. Maybe other gay couples don’t work, but we do.
I could tell Scott anything, literally anything, that was on my mind or in my heart. I’ve stayed with him through good times and bad. We’ve both been sick and healthy, successful and frustrated, happy and sad. When we were flat broke, we shared our ramen noodles. We recently bought our second and much nicer house, and we are preparing to adopt children.
Do I still find him sexually attractive? Yes, I admit that I do. I find it curious that you would use this against me. I would think, you know, that if your husband found you sexually attractive, you would be happy about it, rather than considering it a strike against his fidelity.
But at the same time, if all I wanted was an attractive guy to sleep with, I could probably do better than Scott. After all this time, though, and after all we have had in common, and all our past experiences, and all our plans for the future, I simply don’t want to go out looking for something like that. Other guys are nice to look at, but I’m not dumb enough to throw away my life for them. Maybe some other gays are, but that’s them, not me.
As to being frustrated with women: No. I never had any interest at all in women. Not a bit. Again, I’m sorry to disappoint you.
I am not disappointed, I have watched over and over and over a different reality. I find it strange that you would think I am disappointed. My only objective is to raise an awarness of another way of being. And to state that the homosexual community is guilty of just as much discrimation to hetero-phophia as some straight persons are to homo-phophia.
That is is possible that someone may be in a gay relationship, yet not be born specificly attracted to men and visa versa..and THUS being gay and “return” to a straight life. Does that mean they were converted? No, it means they discovered who they really were after exploration…but the gay community at large will not accept this.
You may be one of the few that are born with your status. That is ok and I am happy for you. However, from my point of view, you discounted the orginal writers opinion that can and may apply to others - and it appeared you fell into the catagory of one size fits all. I am glad you said you did not speak for the gay community, that is fair of you. One can only speak for themselves.
I too only speak for myselfs and my experiences. I am really sick and tired of the discrimiation that I have seen in the gay community. I am sick of the negative relationships, where one party of a partnership, feels sex has nothing to do with the relationship..they go out on their partner and do not see what the big deal is. I watch the pain of my friends.
Then there are those who I KNOW are bisexual or who choose to be gay for emotional safety. Men that may be in a gay partnership…yet staring down a women’s naked body or breasts..only to be followed with “I am gay gay gay”..ya right. They can not be true to themselves BECAUSE of the predjuice. If they were truely 100% homsexual they would be like you and simply not interested …. but they are. Yet to admit this interest to others, especially other gay men is extremely dangerous terriorty. I have watched the other gay man slam and I do mean slam the poor guy emotionally. Telling him to pick sides. If you are born a certain way..you can’t. Yet they think by verbal abuse they can force someone to change their nature..which sounds awfully familar coming from the other direction.
Discrimiation is huge and it is not just a heterosexual problem..
Just as I am straight and have to put into check those people who discrimate aganist same sex relationships, I feel it is your job to perform the same duty from the other side. Put homsexual individuals in check for their prejudice.
I appericate you willingness to discuss, yet I also felt the need for balance and to open the minds of people to alternatives that no one seems willing to admit.
“Men that may be in a gay partnership…yet staring down a women’s naked body or breasts..only to be followed with “I am gay gay gay”..ya right. They can not be true to themselves BECAUSE of the predjuice. If they were truely 100% homsexual they would be like you and simply not interested …. but they are.”
Just b/c a gay man has *some* degree of attraction to women doesn’t mean he is fully attracted to them and could therefore “choose” to flourish heterosexually. You err, like many others, when you assume there are only 3 boxes — gay straight and bi — and by implication, a bisexual is fully attracted to both genders and therefore has a “choice.” Sexuality actually falls along a continuum (Kinsey rated the scale from 0-6, with 0 purely hetero, and 6 purely homo). Someone who is a Kinsey 5 is fully attracted to the same sex, but only incidentally attracted to the opposite. Such a person may be able to perform in the short run, heterosexually, but in the long run can only flourish homosexually.
And there are a lot more Kinsey 1s (people who are by in large hetero, incidentally homo) than Kinsey 5s. I believe there are more Kinsey 1s and 2s than self identified gays or bis, that they likely comprise double digits of any given world population, they define and understand themselves to be “hetero” or “normal” (not part of the “gay or bi” community) and simply blend in to the normal straight population. Likewise, though they may be able to experiment with and enjoy homosexual behavior, they would not be able to “choose” to be gay, because they wouldn’t be able to flourish in the long run with exclusive or even predominant homosexuality. Some recent historical figures who might fall in this box include Mick Jagger, David Bowie, Pete Townsend, Marlon Brando, James Dean, Cary Grant, Madonna, and many others. I don’t know why I’m listing so many men as the phenom is more clearly identifiable in women.
Debbie –
One of the problems we’re having in this discussion, I think, is that you and I can offer many anecdotes without ever conclusively proving anything about gays in general.
For example, I can name several same-sex couples — both male and female — in my circle of friends who have been together longer than I’ve been alive. But if I’m being perfectly fair, I can also name several people who might have to agree with a lot of what you’ve said about impermanent gay relationships. I’m not sure that our anecdotes will do much toward answering the real question, which is, as I see it: Given the reality of same-sex sexual attraction, and the reality of same-sex long-term love, what moral status do we ascribe to these relationships?
I’m not quite as convinced as you are that the gay community is heterophobic or that it is unwilling to let “its” people slide back toward heterosexuality. I think for the most part that this is a stereotype, and that most gay people today recognize that there is room for people attracted to both genders at different times in their lives. (Yes, with a stereotype there’s a grain of truth, and sometimes gay people are intolerant in this way. But, frankly, the younger generation of gays have put up with enough labels and stereotyping and “you have to do X and Y and Z.” We’re fed up with this stuff, too, wherever it comes from.)
So yes, we are skeptical of the ex-gay movement, but we are skeptical mainly because of the extravagant promises that ex-gays make, and because of the often patronizing tone that they assume toward us — a tone I hoped to capture in this post. We aren’t all hurting, and abused, and desperate. Some of us are actually happy.
Meanwhile, I do think you are right that it’s often easier to say you are “just” straight or you are “just” gay, rather than saying that you are bisexual or that you are somewhere in between. I think it’s sad that the world is like this, and I think that people who experience attraction to both genders, in whatever degree, ought to be able to examine their own feelings here and not feel pressured by others to conform in either direction.
To give an example from my own life — I hesitate a bit to share this, but I think it’s probably for the best — my own partner, whom you see in the pictures, is not exclusively gay. He’s about a 5 on the Kinsey scale. Every so often, he finds a woman attractive. I can’t empathize with it, but I accept that it’s a part of who he is, and I accept that it’s a legitimate feeling, and it would be wrong of me to tell him to “stop” feeling this way. And yet we do know, both of us, that these are just temporary attractions, as passing as the attractions I sometimes feel for other men. What we’ve built together remains far more important.
Now, when someone isn’t a perfect 0 (heterosexual) or 6 (like me) on the Kinsey scale, what do we do with that person? What does he do with himself? These are questions that require much sensitivity and discretion. The gay community hasn’t always done well by them. But if a good friend of mine who called himself gay suddenly found himself attracted to a woman and wanted to start a relationship with her, I would not say no. I would say something like this: “I hope the two of you can be happy together. I admit I’m surprised — I mean, I did think you were gay and all — but if you really are happy, then you have my blessing. I hope that you two will make it work, whatever you call yourselves. Whatever it is, be sure about it, be true, and I think you’ll do right. It’s not easy, being happy in this world, and if you’ve got it, then great.”
That’s what I’d say. Does it sound good to you?
That sound respectable me and I appericate the forthrighness of what you say about your partner. That takes guts to admit and explains why you may understand the situtation of many individuals who do not fit into the mold of the traditional. Only a person, gay or straight, who totally accept themselves and others can make these kind of statments. My hats off to you.
It is also true that our experiences are not necessarily scientific in nature. Honestly I know of one couple who seem to have settled into a happy long term relationship, but not without some bumps and wanderings of one party. The same can be said for many of my straight friends, however if I dare to note a common different between my own control set, is that the male gay couples tend to not communicate emotional feelings and needs nearly as much as the straight couples. They claim that such express is unimportant where as I believe that communication on a emotional level is essential to the success of a long term life of a relationship.
Be as that may, it hard for me to watch friends go through unnecessary stress due to the their same sex gay friends punish them for out of the box thinking.
I agree that the mear mention of the subject must be meet with discretion and care. I also note there will always be individuals of any lifestyle, who are insecure enough with themselves and must attempt to force others in order to justify themselves. Does not matter if it is lifestyle or religion, people want others to be part of their club.
My only additional food for thought, is that I do not believe in the “ex-gay” concept. Rather, I do believe people can select to be in a gay relationshp, without necessarily being naturally gay. Thus the return to a hetero relationship is not ex-gay. Women who have had lesbian experiences and partners do this all the time and yet are not assigned the gay catagory when they return to a hetero relationship, that seems to be a male only label and I have to wonder why. Why does it have to be “ex” anything?
I hesitate to use the scientific Kinsey scale as a generalized use of a individuals desires in that the name has it’s own overtones and labels. Why can not an individual be in a gay relationship or a straight relationship, without past baggage? They are what they are right now and nothing more. Although I will respect the research and effort put into the study and it does work as a guide line of explaination.
As a final comment, we are in complete agreement with respect to a friend and whoever they want to be with. I just want individuals to be happy and content with their life, whoever that may be with. Like you I am open to the options and happiness of people I know.
We have come full circle.
Jonthan -
I want to quickly comment on your note. With respect to a man who is in a gay relationship and still being attracted to women, I find your reaction typical. It is not a sterotypical theory, it is a living experience with some gay men friends of mine and what they have expressed to me.
Why do you need to so badly demand that once in a gay relationship…is forever a gay person? Why not accept the individual as is?
Survivial in a gay relationship does not assume that you are particpating in a gay community. You may desire to be with an individual because of who they are and have absolutely no desire to associate with the external lifestyle. I have a friend who is presently in a gay relationship for over 8 years..and is not happy.
Like I said in a previous note, I have issues with definieing people based on a cold scientific scale. Why can not an individual be in a gay relationship or a straight relationship, without past baggage or assigning of a priority and labels? They are what they are right now and nothing more. The past mearly made them what they are today.
Women who have experienced lesbian relationships do this ALL THE TIME, with no forward binding of sexual prefence label. I am not sure why the men feel so threatend with the same concept. If a man is secure with who he is, this concept should neither threaten or cause any sort of reaction. It is just accepted.
Consider that.
Hi!
I am a Brit and as such have never even heard of the “ex gay” movement before! Although we have a lot of bigotry over here too we tend not to adopt a pseudo-Christian stance to justify it.
I stumbled upon this site completely by accident and thought that it was very well done. Too many people on both sides of the debate use strong language, personal attacks and hyperbole to persue their argument. You chose simply to juxtapose pictures of your normal, everyday life (the type of life that most committed couples, gay or straight, would aspire to) with the type of condescending moralistic prose that is written by people who don’t have peace or happiness in their own life and/or haven’t properly researched their subject area. It was the most eloquent pro-gay argument I think I have ever seen! :o)
The main problem with trying to generalise about any group is that, despite some small differences, people are all just people. Before me, my boyfriend had never had a long term relationship and had always cheated on the girls he had gone out with. He spent all his life in bars or with his mates. Now he would rather spend time in the garden or with our kittens than go to a club. He has found a lifestyle and a partner who makes him feel secure and no longer feels the need to sleep around. This is true of lots of my male friends, gay and straight, and to a certain extent my female friends too, when they are not committed to a relationship they are likely to go out without their partners and see what else they can get. But this is not commented on so much because it does not strike people as so “abnormal” or “unhealthy”.
We should never judge the fidelity or success of his relationship by how a man behaves publicly. In heterosexual relationships throughout the world men often cheat, they often spend more time watching sport or driving their cars than they do with their girlfriends, they often do not like to hold hands in public or tell people how in love they are (In fact the gay guys I know are more likely to behave lovingly, or to express their emotions, than the straught guys I know!)but - and this is the important point - when they get home they still like a good cuddle and to feel that they have someone to belong to and who belongs to them.
Sorry for the rant! My best friend is gay and I often have to spend a stupid proportion of my evenings out escaping from drunken idiots who think that his life is their business. He has a good job, works hard, is very intelligent, a great laugh, and has the nicest boyfriend in the world that he has been with for years. They are about 12, with no prospects, and probably a whole host of illegitimate children that will drain our economy for the rest of their lives, but who think that they are better than him because they like girls.
The world is an odd place!
PS - Just as a little comment to “Debbie K” above - The whole conversion fantasy is not just a gay phenomenon. I know lots of women who have cried buckets over gay men that they “love but con’t have” and many many men who have fantasies about pretty lesbians who’ll find them attractive and let them join in! ;o) I think people like the idea of it because it’s the ultimate ego boost - “I like you so much you have made me put aside everything that went before you. Your looks and personality are so wonderful that I now fancy a different gender” blah blah
Becky -
I think you missed the point of the conversation. This was not about straight people wanting gay persons or straight men, wanting to be with lesbians. This conversation was not a fantasy, rather very much the reality of people putting stamps on others. I know too many women, who where “lesbians” and are now straight. Yet they are not called homosexual anymore. That is very much reality.
Likewise, I have a “former” gay friend, who considers himself bisexual. Now he is with a women and going strong. Was it anti-gay, absolutely not. He just now found himself attracted to a women, nothing more complicated than that.
I am saying that people are attracted to, who they are attracted to. Some call it bisexual, but that concept is also misleading. Because there is more to attraction than just physical, it is also emotional and intellegical. The right combination forms all of it. Why not take people by who they are at this moment..and not what they have lived iwth in the past.
HI TO EVERYONE, I WAS JUST PASSING BY AND FOUND THIS WEBSITE. MY NAME IS RICK, I´M FROM MEXICO, AND I´M A FORMER GAY, IF YOU WANT TO CALLED IT LIKE THAT. HOPE THAT WITH THIS STATEMENT, YOU WON´T GET ANGRY OR ANYTHING, I´M NOT TRYING TO OFFEND ANYONE OF YOU GUYS, JUST TRYING TO TELL YOU GUYS WHAT I THINK.
AS I SAID MY NAME IS RICK, I´M 23 YEARS OLD, AND I WAS CONFUSED WITH MY SEX ORIENTATION, FOR A WHILE, LIKE ALMOST 3 YEARS OF MY LIFE, FROM 18 TO 21, WHEN DESTINY CHANGE MY LIFE.
IT´S HARD TO RESUME ALL THIS YEARS, IN JUST A FEW PARAGRAPHS. I USED TO BE THE TYPICAL GAY GUY, HANDSOME, GOOD LOOKING, AND A PLAYER, I USED TO HAVE FUN EVERYTIME I MET A GUY, EVEN TO TALK OR JUST TO FULL AROUND. DURING THIS TREE YEARS, I HAD A GREAT TIME, I CAN´T REFUSE THAT, I HAD MANY FRIENDS, AND MANY PARTNERS, BUT JUST ONE GOT MY HEART, BECAUSE I GOT TO ADMIT THAT I FALL IN LOVE FOR A GUY FOR QUITE A WHILE.
MY LIFE DURING THIS PERIOD WAS KIND OF A MESS, BECAUSE I HAD TO HAVE A DOUBLE LIFE, ONE IN COLLEGE, HOME AN SOCIAL STATUS, AND ANOTHER WHEN I WAS WITH MY GAY FRIENDS. IT WAS PRETTY STRESSING HAVING TO HIDE MY SEXUAL PREFERENCES MUST OF THE TIME, I WAS FRUSTATED BECAUSE I COULDN´T TELL ALL THE WORLD WHAT I REALLY WAS FEELING, I ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT I WAS GOING TO BE GAY ALL MY LIFE, AND I ALWAYS WAS TRYING TO JUSTIFIED MY BEHAVOUR AND PROUD OF MY GAY LIFE. I WAS ALWAYS LOOKING FOR A PRETTY FACE, NICE BODY, BUT ALSO SOMEONE WITH NOT JUST TWO HEADS, SOMEONE TO HANG AROUNG, PLAY, SPEND MUST OF MY TIME, SOMEONE THAT WASN´T A QUEER BUT ATRACTIVE MALE, WITH VALUES, HONEST WITH HIMSELF, INTELLIGENT, THAT YOU CAN TALK FOR HOURS, SOMEONE TO HUG ME, TO MAKE ME FEEL GOOD, AND SOMEONE TO GIVE ME LOVE, NOT IN A SEX WAY.
BUT EVERYTIME I MET A GUY, ALL THAT THEY WANTED WAS SEX, AS I SAID I MET SOMEONE, THAT I FALL IN LOVE, UNFURTUNETLY THE LIFE THAT WE HAD IN OUR GAY LIFE, ISN´T THE BEST, YOU CAN ALWAYS FOUND SOMEONE NEW, YOUNGER, HANDSOME, ATTRACTIVE, OR WITH MONEY, SO CHEATING IS ALWAYS EASY, SPECIALLY WHEN YOU MIX TWO MENS TOGETHER. GAY LIFE ISN´T EASY EVEN YOU LIVE IN AMERICA, EUROPE, ASIA, OR AFRICA, YOU ARE ALWAYS POINTED OUT, DISCRIMINATED, UNSECURE, SOMETIMES YOU ARE RUNNING IN DANGER TO CONTRACT AIDS, AND SOMETIMES WE DON´T LOOK IN TO THE NEAR FUTURE, WE TRYED TO LIVE IN TO THE PRESENT, ENJOYING OURSELFS, POPULARITY, ETC. THE GAY LIFE ISN´T EASY SPECIALLY WHEN YOU ARE GROWING OLDER, AND YOU GUYS CAN´T REFUSE THAT, JUST GO IN TO THE CLUBS AND LOOK IN TO THE GUYS THAT ARE OLDER, ALWAYS LOOKING FOR A YOUNG ASS, PRETTY FACE, OR SOMEONE TO TAKE CARE AND GIVE SOME MONEY TO MAINTAIN.
AFTER THIS TREE YEARS, MY MOM COME AROUND AN ASK ME IF I WAS GAY? I SAY YES, AND SHE STARTED TO CRIED ALL NIGHT LONG, I WAS SO STUBBERN, SO PROUD OF MY LIFE, THAT I DIDN´T REALIZE THE NIGHTMARE OF THE LIFE THAT I WAS GIVING TO MY FRIENDS, AND TO MY FAMILY, BUT ALSO TO ME I WAS SO CONCERN ABOUT ME, THAT I FORGOT THAT THERE WERE SOME FRIENDS OUT THERE, THAT WERE WORRIED ABOUT ME. MY MOM TOLD ME THAT I WAS GOING TO CHANCE, NO MATTER WHAT I THINK, SHE HAD A LOT OF FAITH IN GOD, I DIDN´T.
AFTER ONE MONTH, I DECIDED TO GO TO AN SPIRITUAL RETIREMENT, JUST TO FIND SOME PEACE IN MY SOULD, I WAS SO DEPRESED WITH ALL THAT HAD HAPPENDED IN TO MY LIFE, ALL THAT I LIVED, NOT HAVING A SINGLE FRIEND TO STAND FOR ME, OR TO LYE IN TO HIM, NOT A FAITHFULL PARTNER, JUST A SEXUAL PREFERENCE THAT WAS NOT COMMUN. I WAS SO SAD, TILL GOD DID HIS PART OF HIS JOB, ALL OF THE SUDDEN I REALIZE THE MISTAKE THAT I WAS DOING WITH MY LIFE, BUT WHAT REALLY CHANGE MY LIFE, WAS RECIVING HIS TRUE AND INCONDITIONAL LOVE, A LOVE THAT ENTER IN MY HEARTH AND THAT STAYS TILL THIS DAY.
I KNOW FOR SOME PEOPLE THIS MAY SOUND ACKWARD, AND NOT POSSIBLE, BUT BELIEVE ME, I DIDN´T WANT TO CHANGE, I DIDN´T WANT TO LEAVE MY LIFE, BUT WHEN I REALIZE THAT THE GAY LIFE WASN´T MEANT FOR ME, EVERYTING AROUND ME CHANGED.
IT ISN´T EASY WHEN YOU HAD A LIFE, AND YOU DECIDED TO CHANGE IT, IT WAS PAINTFULL HAVING TO CLOSE ALL MY CIRCULES, HAVING TO GO AWAY FROM MY GAY FRIENDS, AND THE GAY COMUNITY, IT WASN´T EASY BEING ALONE AND START ALL OVER AGAIN. THIS HAPPENED TREE YEARS AGO.
ONE YEAR AFTER THIS EXPERIENCE I DECIDED TO GO TO A TERAPIST, AND WITH SOME HARD WORK, I DISCOVERED THAT NO ONE BORNS BEING HOMOSEXUAL, THERE ARE THE CIRCUNSTANCES THAT MAKE YOU THINK THAT YOU HAVE A SEXUAL PREFERENCE FOR YOUR SAME SEX, IN MY CASE, WAS THE LACK OF A FATHER, HE WAS ALWAYS HITTING ME, SAYING THAT I WAS AND ASSHOLE, HE NEVER GAVE ME TRUE LOVE, I NEVER HAD THAT LOVE THAT IS SO IMPORTANT FOR EVETYONE, THE LOVE AND FIGURE OF OUR DAD, ALL THAT I WAS ALWAYS LOOKING IN A GUY WAS MYSELF, SOMEONE SECURE ABOUT HIMSELF, CONFIDENT, DECIDED, HANDSOME, ATTRACTIVE TO WOMEN, THAT CARES ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE, AND THAT ISN´T AFRAID TO SAY I LOVE YOU, BECAUSE I DIDN´T HAVE AN IDENTITY AT THAT TIME, I REALIZE THAT AFTER ONE YEAR OF THERAPHY.
MAYBE IF YOU ARE READING ALL THIS, YOU MIGHT THINK THAT YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT SITUATTION AND I DON´T DOUBT IT, IN MY EXPERIENCE, ALL OF US, ARE LOOKING FOR THE HUG, LOVE AND CARE OF OUR OWN DAD, OUR OURSELFS. WE DECIDED TO BE GAY BECAUSE THERE ARE MANY FACTORS THAT CONTRIBUTED TO TAKE THIS WAY OF LIFE, EVEN IF YOU WERE RIPED WHEN YOU WERE A LITTLE CHILD, EVEN IF YOUR MOM DIDN´T GIVE YOU THE LOVE YOU WERE LOOKING FOR, OR IF YOUR PARENT ARE NOT TOGETHER, OR DEATH BUT WE CAN CHANGE, THE CHANGE IS POSSIBLE, IT ISN´T EASY AS TAKING AND ASPIRINE, BUT YOU CAN DO IT. UNFURTUNETLY THIS CHANGE DOESN´T COME BY OURSELF BUT BY GOD, AND BY REALIZING THAT WE ARE NOT MEANT TO BE GAY, BUY A NORMAL GUY OR A GIRL
I´M NOT THE ONLY ONE GUY THAT HAVE EXPERIENCE THIS CHANGE, AND THERE ARE GOING TO BE MORE MALE AND FEMALE THAT WOULD THING THAT THEY HAVE A SEXUAL PREFERENCE TO HIS OR HER OWN GENDER, AT LEAST YOU GOT TO KNOW THAT YOU CAN ALWAYS CHANGE, NO MATTER YOUR AGE. NO MATTER WHAT, BECAUSE ITSN´T IMPOSSIBLE, IT´S REAL. YOU MIGHT HAVE MORE QUESTIONS, YOU MIGHT BE ANGRY WITH MY LIFE, BUT MY FRIEND YOU CAN CHANGE, IF IT WASN´T WORTH IT, I WOULD BE WRITTING THIS LINES. GOD LOVE YOU NO MATTER WHAT.
I know the statement: “Real love is nurturing and fulfilling. It’s something that two men just can’t have for each other” is false. And what’s more I can prove it.
You, see before I was ready to admit that I was gay, I was married to a woman. I loved her very much - otherwise I would never have gotten married. As I got older I realised however that I was not happy. I did not love my partner in the way that I should. As we had lived together for a total of 14 years, it was quite dissapointing - I really thought she was the one for me - I had convinced myself. However, I knew inside me that I had feelings for men. I had hidden them and denied them for many years. I did not act on my feelings and for many years I stayed faithful to my wife.
In due course I eventually met a man. I told him about my desires and feelings. I shared everything with him and told him about how I felt and how I was living a lie. I fell in love with him and bonded with him in a way I never could with my wife. Eventually, because I didn’t want to lie anymore to her, or to myself, I told her the truth. It was hurtful and a difficult thing to do but it was the right thing to do. Keeping a lie is always much worse than telling the truth - no matter how hard it is. When I eventually moved in with this guy, I was so happy and I’m still happy (8 years later). Even friends and family thought I looked happier. Colleagues at work mentioned it to me, they probably thought there was a new woman in my life - or perhaps that I’d come in to money.
The happiness gets better every day now - we would do anything for each other, we even seem to know what the other is thinking. And let me tell you this, the love I have for him surpasses the love I had for my wife - and I should know, as I have had the chance to make a direct comparison. I know now that the love I had for her was only because society expected it of me and I was too weak to stand up and be counted. I tried to conform to other people’s “normality” and tried to deny my own nature. Luckily I found out in time and acted to reverse the dammage. So don’t talk to me about Ex-Gays, coz I’m an Ex-Str8.
Awesome. ^_^
I am an 18 year old M who happens to be gay I tried for the longest time to be str8, I didn’t know what was “wrong” with me. No one knew or knows for that matter, its so hard to be a gay guy especially in highschool. If anyone knew they would hate me, I mean I am no different than anyone else its just I happen to like men, I am thought by everyone to be str8 and its been really helpfull reading on your website. Its good to know that there is nothing wrong with me nor my mentalitly. Its difficult when the people you love and care so deeply about slander homosexuals and talk about how they are crazy or messed up in the head. I don’t know when the “coming out” process will start but I wanted to say much thanks for not being afraid to put it out there, if only more people would just stand up (yes I am being slighly hypocritical I know) then maybe there wouldn’t be such taboo on homosexuality.
ps your story is freakishly how mine has started I mean really freakishly from jokes to accepatace to boyscouts to meeting open people thanks for sharing
Thanks, whatever your name is. I like to think I made a deal with the world: I’d come out, and if everything went okay, I’d always help other peple do the same. I’ve helped dozens of people this way, and it’s one of the things that makes me happiest about what I’ve accomplished in my life. Now just about exactly ten years after coming out, I have no regrets whatsoever.
Bravo, my friend, bravo. Keep up the good fight. I’ve heard this same crap being fed to me in my own church and even my own home. The sad thing is that some people actually believe that they are acting in love when they try to “turn” a homosexual.
The author of the letter is full of so many generalizations, it’s sickening. People should open their eyes to the fact that a homosexual relationship and a heterosexual relationship are no different, except for the aspect of same sex love. Otherwise, the love is still their, the devotion is still there, everything necessary for a good and healthy relationship is there.
I’m straight, and thus not up on all the current gay issues, so correct me if I’m wrong, but hasn’t the whole “ex-gay” movement been discredited? I remember hearing horror stories on the net (ok, reading) from news sites about brainwashing and physical abuse, and that like 95% of “convert” went back.
Either way, the people who send you these letters are idiots, i never chose to be straight, and i’ve seen scientific research showing gays don’t either.
(BTW. Great Site)
What a beautiful way of answering such mindless prejudice! Loved the photos and many congratulations on your wedding.
Fortunately God isn’t nearly as stupid as the ex-gay movement would have him be. Any Christian who uses the brain that God gave him can see that morality isn’t about whether you are gay or straight, but how you live your life.
Your love for one another and commitment in marriage is as valid a fulfillment of the teachings of Jesus Christ in the gospels as any heterosexual marriage.
Love and God bless
Daniel
Courage! but live pure, Soon the walls are going to fall!
Im Christian and what i´m gonna say is very radical. I knew God since i was a kid but i questión him for years about my sexuality now i have fully peace about who I´m his blessing to me Í know men hear society opinion is funny , macho aactitud always hide sth is real false in this earh ………but most importante i know God, his support in this are wonderfull.
He will answer me the same as jason and scot , I´m very happy to see this pic today.
.
Juanito.
I am ex-gay and am still apalled by the letter you received. I don’t understand why someone would send such an igonorant letter and seriously mean it.
peace,
spencer
Sounds like my parents.
Hey, Im a 17 year old “ex gay” as most would put it. Just to let you know we arent all weirdos, bigots and satanists! I accept that some gays, like yourself are happy with their sexuality, and so you should be, you look very happy in your pictures. But for others like me it can cause problems. I had sexual feelings solely for men, but I only ever fell in “romantic” love with women, so for me It was a matter of choosing which gender Id be happier with. Ive worked hard with my therapy and don’t think ex-gays should be criticised as heavily as we are.
Please note this irony:
Gay people had to fight against oppostion to their sexuality, but now gay people are opposing the ex-gay sexuality in an even worse way (sayign there is no such thing, they are in denial, they are homophobes etc), that is what I call hypocritical.
Rich,
I know that not all ex-gays are weirdos. (And of course most consider themselves Christians, not satanists!)
Questioning someone else’s sexual orientation is, in a way, kind of pointless: You can’t ever get inside someone else’s head and determine what they are really feeling, and much less can you determine what’s right for them. All that anyone can say is “I hope you are happy.” So I will say this to you: I hope you are happy.
I also hope that you will actually be able to satisfy your life partner, both romantically and sexually. Simply wanting to be around and liking the company of someone is not enough. You will have to (have to!) please them sexually, as well. I don’t know whether you can do this, and I worry a little bit about it: If you have no sexual feelings for women, this may become a significant problem in your life. To say nothing of hers.
Now, as to the irony you mention: No, gay people most certainly are not opposing ex-gays in “an even worse way” than gays themselves were opposed.
Until ex-gays are routinely fired, arrested, jailed, fined, castrated, beaten, raped, and murdered, they will not have suffered in the way that gays did.
We oppose ex-gay therapy not because it always fails, but because it makes promises that so often are unfulfilled. The vast majority of people who try ex-gay therapy fail. And as they do, they suffer. This is wrong and it needs to stop, particularly because so many of these people would have happier lives as openly gay men and women.
Our methods? Persuasion. That’s all. Not the rest. Don’t delude yourself that you are a persecuted minority as an ex-gay. You aren’t.
Yes, now I do have sexual feelings for women (arousal, lust and all the rest) and I look forward to being intimate with a woman. You know, maybe this is because I am 17 and have gone through a “phase” of homosexuality but thats exactly my point: the pro-gay community insist that people are born with a sexuality and it is fixed. Well If mine and many others people’s sexuality changes over time (even if only during their teenage years) then that shows that sexuality is not hardwired. Again maybe Ive just been through a phase but it is a slight coincidence that the change begun after I had started therapy.
Also although ex-gays do not suffer in the same physical sense we are still persecuted. I am called a liar, bigot, homophobe, in denial or suffering from “internalized homophobia” and generally ridiculed for my beliefs and for my decisions in external sources such as the media. Many popular TV shows, chat shows, soap operas etc denounce the ex gay community as a sham and I have to face this and put up with this everyday. Im pretty sure many gay people would like to “kick me in” for my beliefs. You do not know what Its like hearing gay-activists lies (born gay, 10% are gay, sexuality is fixed) and knowing that many innocent kids out there are going to be hurt by these fallacies. Kids should be told they can adopt any sexuality they wish. I was suicidal and suffering before I started therapy, so without there support I probably wouldn’t be here to type this message.
You’ve probably already made your assumptions of me and thats fine, but let me tell you this. Im not a religous person, nor are my parents. Believe it or not my parents are very pro-gay so I cannot even “come out” so to speak about my sexuality in case they turn on me like the rest of society. I think I know pretty damn well what its like to suffer.
Well, Rich, you certainly have a lot of preconceived notions about me, too, and about the gay community. Dialogue is where we dispel these, and where we do our best not to wallow in them. So let’s see what we can do…
I think you will find that the responsible observers in the gay community do not make the blanket statements that so infuriate you. The real point of “coming out” as a social movement is not to make everyone as gay as possible. It’s to make sure that everyone lives a rich, full, authentic, honest life, regardless of their orientation. And this of course includes those who have both fixed and fluid sexualities.
My own experience was quite fixed — I tried very hard to think about women sexually, and there was just no response. Neither lust, nor revulsion, nor any kind of spark at all. But whenever I thought about men, the results were very different.
You, however, say that you have changed. Just as I ask for my own acceptance, I should ask for yours, too. Perhaps it was only a “phase” on your part — but aren’t all changes, of any type, indicative of a “phase” someone went through? Even adult sexuality is a phase, if you think about it that way.
What responsible critics argue is that most people (indeed the overwhelming majority) receive no benefit from ex-gay therapy, and that most people find it a deeply miserable experience. There have been numerous studies to back up these claims. Responsible critics also point out that ex-gay advocates usually push a large number of harmful stereotypes about gays and lesbians. They say that we are broken. That we aren’t fully people. That we are victims. That we are deeply unhappy and always will be.
These stereotypes are usually on display in the messages I get from the ex-gay movement. I wrote the above essay to counteract them, by simply showing what my life was actually like.
If you really do possess a fluid sexuality, you should keep in mind that it may change again in the future. It may just be that there are more types of sexuality, beyond just homo- hetero- and bi-. Some of each type may be able to change, while some of each may not. You might just be a very changeable person, and — who knows — you may have to live with these changes throughout your life. I wish you the best of everything, wherever you end up.
Finally, I just have one thought on your comment “I think I know pretty damn well how to suffer.”
Hate to break it to ya, kid, but every 17-year-old in the entire world believes they already know how to suffer. Not all of them really do.
Consider my example: By the time I was your age, my father had told me that if he ever found I was queer, he would “kick me out of the house.” As I grew up I routinely heard him make jokes about fags and queers, and I knew from age fifteen that if I was ever discovered, I would be homeless.
Turns out, I had it easy. I hid it from him until I could support myself on my own. He’s only recently started trying to have a normal relationship with me. This has hurt a lot, but I forgive him.
Some gay teens aren’t so lucky, and these do end up homeless. In fact, the single most common reason for American teenage homelessness is because a parent kicked a child out of the house for being gay. I do think that the ex-gay movement’s time and energy would be better spent in reuniting these families, rather than chasing what is for nearly everyone an impossible dream.
This is to say nothing of gays in places like Pakistan, Iran, or Saudi Arabia, where homosexual acts can prompt either a legal or an informal death sentence.
Suffering? Puh-lees. Neither you nor I know the half of it.
Whoever wrote such a letter to you is a moron. I couldn’t believe when this person said that “Real love is nurturing and fulfilling and something that two men can’t have for each other”. Who is he to judge the quality of your love and devotion to one another?? By his comments, this person seems to believe that a relationship between two men can only consist of lust and sex, and that “only heterosexuals sacrifice themselves and their personal desires for each other”. I guess that’s why the divorce rate for heterosexuals is close to 50% , because of all the “sacrifices” that they make for each other!!!!
So to you Jason and Scott I wish you love and happiness always, and I trust you are not affected by the misguided and judgmental remarks of such foolish people……….perhaps we should feel sorry for them because they obviously don’t know what true love really is………….
Hi there!
I’m Suzy, I’m 18, I’m annoyed.
One thing I detest is people forcing their views upon other people, trying to brainwash people, change their beliefs. It disgusts me. Although I am an atheist, I have no problem with people believing in God, and following religion. What I find unsettling, (to put it mildly!) is when christians, or any other people, knock on my door and tell me that I am wrong. I leave them be, and have no problem with them. And after all did it not say in the bible - do to your neighbour as you would have him do unto you? Or something to that effect! They certainly wouldn’t want me telling them to stop believing in God because I, one person, thinks its a load of b******s. Live and let live.
If a person is attracted to the same sex that is there business and their business only.
And anyway.. why does disease exist? It could be “God’s” way of controlling the population. (I am going somewhere with this, honest) Why can some women not have children? The same reason perhaps. Could it not also be that God made some people ‘homosexual’ to control the population? Therefore it would infact be a very christian lifestyle… food for thought! With all the propblems; environmental, demographic, even political and social, caused by overpopulation, homosexuality may be a very wise concept, a very global minded, considerate lifestyle. (not that most people choose it, however. ‘God’ Knows how many apparently straight people are actually gay but social pressure and prejudices prevent them from being themselves.
I am also not keen on people being labelled. I have been in a relationship with another woman for nearly a year and a half, (my first relationship with another women), but I do not call myself a lesbian. Some people may say “she’s in denial!” but this is not the case.. if I was in denial, I would not have been with her for so long, or told all my friends and my parents! So when people ask me, are you gay? I reply “No, I’m Suzy”. My sexual preference is a tiny part of who I am, and should certainly not be a major identifying feature of me! Of course, this is my own opinion and I have nothing against people who don’t mind being labelled, so long as they have nothing against my choices. I don’t feel it’s necessary to join groups or clubs or societies, nor do I feel part of a “gay community”. I am a human being, and I am a part of the global community, with all its wonderfully mismatched diverse components.
So that was my roundabout, beat-around-the bush, stop-off-for -a -kebab -on -the -way sort of way of telling the pratt that wrote that letter to sling his hook! He is clearly a very insecure, brainwashed soul, jealous of the happiness you enjoy, that he could never enjoy.
Here ends my wonderfully British rant!
DearJason,
As a Christian and a mom of 2 gay children I want to wish the best of luck and God’s richest blessings on you union.
Jason,
As a healed transgender I do know that the Lord is able to heal all who are afflicted or possessed by a spirit of perversion. I was delivered from such and hope that you will likewise repent and believe the gospel.
The issues that the Lord showed me are these:
The Lord said the last days would be as the days of Noah and as the days of Lot.
Many people haggle over the sin of Sodom and the sin in Noah’s day to justify homosexuality as well as transgenderism.
What is important is not what the sin is but what did it take to be saved?
Noah was hetrosexual as proven by his wife, sons and their wives. None had boyfriends or girlfriends.
Lot was hetrosexual as well having a wife and daughters. The husbands of those daughters chose to stay in sin and wickedness and were destroyed. Just as his wife looked back. The lord trys to heal some but they look back and the GLBT community around them talks them back into believing they are gay.
The way we live is a witness at the throne of God of what we believe. The Lord said “ye shall be witnesses unto me.”
The “seed,” or “seed of copulation” always represents the Word, Lord, Spirit and kingdom of God in a spiritual sense. That which brings forth life in plants, animals and people.
The Lord commanded the children of Israel to go outside the camp to ease themselves and bury that which came out of them so there would be nothing unclean in the camp where he walked.
The word likens our bodies to the camp, tent, tabernacle, synagogue and city.
Why would anyone take something as precious as the word of God and put it in an unclean place? In a spiritual type and shadow that is what two homosexual men are manifesting at the throne of God. A blatent disrespect for the word and Spirit of God and trampling underfoot the blood that was shed at Calvary. Bring him to an open shame before the Cheribims, Ceraphims, angels, the souls of just men made perfect and his Father!
Lesbians manifest at the throne of God that they don’t need a “seed”, “seed of copulation,” the word, the Lord nor his Spirit. Just as there is no seed in their communion to bring forth life there is no seed, or Spirit of Life in them. There cannot be as God will not go against his word. And the Spirit of God will not dwell in an unclean place. It was sent to glorify Jesus.
Every person used as a similtude of Jesus in the old testament was straight.
Noah, a preacher of righteousness (Christ) built an ark (covenant) to save his wife (church) and his sons and their wives.(flock) A type and shadow of a hetrosexual family.
Jesus is returning soon. He’s not coming for a “bud” or a “partner.” He’s not coming for someone born in the wrong body.
He’s returning for a bride. And she better be without spot.
I was at one time a part of the GLBT community. I was delivered from the spirit of perversion that had me bound.
I therefore urge you to repent, fast and pray and seek the Lord’s mercy with all your heart.
I did and he delivered me.
Straight people do not know what it is like to be transgender. I do. It was not a choice. I was bound. But now I am free!
May God bless,
Tiffany
I think you two look awesome together and don’t let anyone ever tell you otherwise. The garden was very beautiful but I advise one thing, add some tulips in there they brighten things up and are pretty sturdy. Good luck you two and congratulations.
Hi,
Is there anyway to know weather your going through a phase or if your like how you are forever? At the moment im 16 and gay…and have been for 2 years. Im out of the closet and yet I still feel like im not supposed to be like this. I dont technically enjoy any sexual experiences with men…(anal sex sort of creeps me out). Ive tried making myself like girls…but its never sexually only socially attracted. Ive been pretty depressed about it for the last year and a half. I really would just like my mind to choose something, but maybe id have to relize something first. i dont even know.
suggestions plz?
While I agree with the author of the letter sent you, I disagree with his tactics. I found your response AWESOME! Too many times I see letters like this responded to with another flame. I applaud you for responding to this letter with great tact and without flames. Excellent response, props to you.
So I seen it asked here how can a stranger make sweeping generalizations about complete strangers living a homosexual lifestyle. Below is a picture taken at IML 2008 in Chicago. Different than average conventions IML celebrates the perversions of gay sexuality that most gays find “fringe” behaviors but go on to say they support everything gay.
http://americansfortruth.com/uploads/2008/05/iml-2008-bestiality-scat-videos-final.JPG
Sure gays want tolerance for their lifestyle while advocating hate and intolerance toward those who believe in something other than their selfish desires. Gays just want to beat the message of “we’re here, get used to it” and were supposed to gleam that there’s a healthy lifestyle in there somewhere between the barebacking and celebrated promiscuity of bath houses and anonymous sex through the internet and personals. But gays still paint themselves as the victims of society when in reality in the last 20 years gays have become the victims of themselves and the behaviors they glorify and use “social intolerance” as their rallying cry. Most people I know don’t care who plays butt darts. They do care being told what to do by a minority who seeks to serve themselves in defiance while countless gays with STD’s and mental issues go ignored as they’re considered to be the “misrepresentation” or the “very few” of the gay culture and do not represent gay life as a whole. It sad you seek to attack and silence those who want to protect the traditional family. No one will ever silence those who are for the traditional families even if the government tries to silence talk of Christianity in public. The First Amendment applies to EVERYONE, not just those with a hostile immoral agenda. In biology class wonder if they’re gonna teach kids babies come from 2 dudes playing butt darts-thats what gays are trying to say when common sense tells you it’s biologically impossible to have 2 male or 2 female anything reproduce and turkey basters aren’t biological either. Lastly-You may think you’re getting what is right for society-no gay has ever mentioned this: When we die and are accountable for our lives Christians know that doing what is right by God is more important than trying to appeal to the masses. Which is more temporary-your single human life or The Creator of the universe?